Rewiring Belief Systems for Success: A Deep Dive with Wendy Watson-Hallowell

In this episode of Career Coaching Secrets our guest is Wendy Watson-Hallowell, widely known as “The Belief Coach,” who specializes in helping individuals and leaders identify, challenge, and rewire limiting beliefs that hold them back from achieving their full potential; we explore her journey into belief-based coaching, the neuroscience and psychology behind mindset transformation, how subconscious patterns influence career success, and the practical frameworks she uses to help clients create lasting personal and professional breakthroughs—drawing insights from her work, thought leadership, and content shared across platforms.

You can find her on:
https://www.belief-works.com/
https://www.facebook.com/thebeliefcoachUS/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/thebeliefcoach/
https://www.instagram.com/thebeliefcoach
https://www.pinterest.com/thebeliefcoach/
Email: wendy@belief-works.com

Transcript

Wendy Watson-Hallowell 0:00

How do you invest in yourself and in your coaching business? And if you don't price it in a way that equals the value, you'll never have what you need to invest back in. It has to be that flow has to come back in. And so when you think about it that way, what's the value? Am I focused on the customers that I need? And again, it has to be niche. I would love it to be everybody because I want everybody to transform.

Davis Nguyen 0:28

Welcome to Career Coaching Secrets, the podcast where we talk with successful career coaches on how they built their success and the hard lessons they learned along the way. My name is Davis Wynne, and I'm the founder of Purple Circle, where we help career coaches scale their business to $100,000 years, $100,000 months, and even $100,000 weeks. Before Purple Circle, I've grown several seven and eight-figure career coaching businesses myself and have been a consultant at two career coaching businesses that are doing over $100 million each. Whether you're an established coach or building your practice for the first time, go discover the secrets to elevating your coaching business.

Pedro Stein 0:59

Welcome to Career Coaching Secrets Podcast. I'm Pedro and I'm joined by Wendy Watson Haliwell, an outcomes expert and trained life coach with 30 years of experience coaching entrepreneurs, grantmakers, nonprofit leaders, and sustainable communities, known as the Belief Coach. She teaches that our underlying beliefs and expectations create our actual experience, helping clients shift both their belief set and practices to achieve the highest possible results professionally and personally. Wendy's unconditional style, combined with honest and direct feedback, gets at the root cause of issues and moves clients quickly to solutions. She's the author of Live a Life You Love and Making a Living Doing It, and Seven Beliefs That Limit Your Life and How to Change That. And her work spans belief coaching, outcomes frameworks, leadership development, and strategic partnerships. Welcome to the show, Wendy.

Wendy Watson-Hallowell 2:07

It's always strange hearing someone talk about you, and when you've been on the planet for a while, the list gets long, you know.

Pedro Stein 2:15

Well, you're the one to blame, you know.

Speaker 1 2:19

I'm happy to be believed for them.

Pedro Stein 2:20

I'll put it like that. And Wendy, it's great to have you. Okay. And I at this time I always love to rewind a bit, you know, get back to the origin story because every coach has that moment where they look at their life and say, Yeah, I guess this is what I'm doing now, right? So when was that for you?

Wendy Watson-Hallowell 2:42

You know, it's funny. There's there's actually two points because one started the ball rolling and then the other one really focused it. So when I was working at MTV back in the early 90s, I realized that I cared more about my people's growth than I did about the company's growth. And I thought, uh oh, I'm in the wrong place, you know. So so that's when um I started experimenting. And my husband and I wrote our first book, and we started life coaching people, and it was working, and it was like, oh, this is cool. And it continued to be kind of on the side, you know, we we were using some of the stuff, and then um then 10 years ago, I had a big breakthrough in releasing my most limiting belief not being enough, and that's what brought through the belief coach. And yeah, I was like, the, do I have to say the? I was like, yeah, the like, okay. So that's how I got very focused on that as um, you know, my main thrust. So yeah, two things.

Pedro Stein 3:41

You know, I love the well, first of all, your business is called Frontier Consulting Group, okay? And then you're telling me that 10 years ago you made uh a big shift. So I love to dive in a little bit into you know, coming from a consulting perspective and moving towards more like coaching, you know, because a lot of times I see uh consultants and that they're facing this big boss, right? The big obstacle, which is you know, people. So, how did that play out for you? You know, how when when did you realize while doing consulting that hey, maybe I need something else here?

Wendy Watson-Hallowell 4:17

It it was more a matter of realizing that the work that I was doing with the group that I was doing was only addressing the high performers, like the low-hanging fruit people to make stuff happen. And I kept seeing people who were not high performers because there was just something in their belief system blocking them from doing it, and so I started suggesting to our organization, hey, we need to focus on this group. And they're like, oh no, no, no, no, we don't want to do that, and and that was part of what had me decide to leave. I didn't know when I was gonna be doing it, the belief coach hadn't clicked in. It was just like this is important, and I know I can make a difference with these people. So it was kind of that intuitive uh feeling about it. And as a consultant, you're constantly coaching people. If if you're doing change management and you're gonna move a group of people from operating one way to operating another way, I don't care what it is, financial, culture, whatever it is, you have to help people change. And if they're gonna change, they're gonna need some one-on-one coaching or support around that. So, you know, we were already doing it, but was under the guise of consulting, you know what I mean?

Pedro Stein 5:34

Yes, more like putting systems in place and all of that, and then you realize you had to help everyone, not just the high achievers, it sounds like now.

Wendy Watson-Hallowell 5:43

Well, that's what it was for me, but it also, if you're gonna do change management and consulting, you're dealing with a group of leaders who need to act in a certain way for everybody to follow along and do the next thing. And so you have people who are in resistance, you've got leaders who don't want to pay attention, and those are coaching conversations. It may not be uh couched as that. Like uh what I've learned in the last 10 years is to actually bake the coaching in as a separate item that's actually happening for the key leaders in my consulting events. One, it helps me get the money. Um, two, it calls it out as something I'm gonna be doing with them one-on-one and giving them that kind of support. And it just helps move things along. Otherwise, a lot of stuff won't finish or happen.

Pedro Stein 6:32

Okay, so you were already in that space, right? In the consulting space. Now, I want to understand the shift, right? Because 10 years ago, you had that big breakthrough, you told me, right? Uh, for your own belief. So when did you felt like the shift from I'm I'm I'm in this space, you know, I'm helping people to, you know what? I actually have a coaching practice, you know. I'm not sure if it was the first client, the first invoice, or how that played out, you know?

Wendy Watson-Hallowell 6:59

That's a great way to put it. Um, well, after I left consulting, I had to sleep for a couple of months because I was just so burnt out. And giving myself some space to not have to generate or push or make deadlines really helped kind of the creative flow coming in and me recognizing my gifts. And my gift is that I see the pattern of belief systems, like I see them. I've been seeing them for a long time, but it got really, really clear. And that's what had me realize it was like, oh, this is something very specific that I see and do, and like it's great, I can bring it to a company, but I can help someone literally transform all the inner chaos that goes on in their head into being in charge, literally, like being that inner CEO. So when I realized that that was a gift I had and got real clear that that's at least right now, part of how I'm supposed to be in service, it was funny because the identity shift is real. It's a real thing. Having, you know, where do I go get business? All my other clients see me as a consultant, as an outcome expert. And being able to articulate to them what I was up to and where I could help them in this new way. Thank goodness I had built some trust with a few clients over the years and they gave me a shot. And the things that I did with them worked. And so then they had the rest of their team get coaching, and and you know, then it kind of spread. And then I had some examples to go and talk to others with, and that kind of created a different group of people who had been coached inside a company that then told their friends or colleagues, and so it gave me like a different uh resource-based network for different kinds of clients, but it took me a while to see myself like that. I remember pitching myself for conferences, like I wasn't just talking about outcomes, I also want to talk about culture. I wanted to talk about your power and kind of mastering your power in the workplace and it just very different topics for me.

Pedro Stein 9:06

Oh, I'm glad you brought that up. That's the exact follow-up question I was going about to make, you know, and the reason I was about to make that is because that is an identity shift, right? And uh what I want to know, it's like after you got rolling, right, on the coaching space, who are the people that cap showing up? Because you already told me it it's a different demographic sometimes. People are like connecting more with coaching, not so much into the consulting branch. So I'm just trying to understand the ones you realize in the coaching, right? Okay, these are the people I work best with. Yeah, you know.

Wendy Watson-Hallowell 9:41

So so the ones that I found, at least for me, um, I'm working with the way I can best describe them is like soulful high achievers. They're already connected to something bigger than just this kind of 3D physical material world, and they're high achievers, and they're usually in some kind of transition, either a life transition or an identity transition. And what used to work for them doesn't work anymore. And so they're at a point of, I've tried other things, it's not really working. So how do I do this? I thought it was all gonna be women, but I get a whole bunch of men, soulful, high-achieving men, artists, you know, uh corporate leaders, um, you know, who are like, oh my god, how do I be me in this space? So so that that tends to be who I'm most helpful with because they have to transform themselves and how they see themselves in order to take that next step in their life or in their business or with their family or wherever it's happening.

Pedro Stein 10:44

Hmm. Okay. Now I want to ask you something because I was a high-ticket sales closer for a coach, I'll put it like that. Okay, and and they were more like towards blue-collar people, and I felt uh uh I I went through a hard time because sometimes I was connecting with them and didn't they didn't get what coaching was. Okay, it was like I was I was part of an awakening process during a discovery call, which makes it harder, right? And when you're saying to me you had soulful high achievers, it's basically someone who already gets it, the importance of it, right? Is that basically what I'm saying?

Wendy Watson-Hallowell 11:26

There's something bigger than them, there's some idea that they're missing what they could be like what they're trying to control isn't working. So, what do I do? What do I control instead? And that that's even if that isn't a conscious, clear question yet, that's kind of what's going on in the back. It's also from a consciousness perspective, Pedro. I don't know if you know anything about David Hawkins and and the book Power versus Force and the whole consciousness scale. I won't work with someone if they're still in pride. I I'm not able to be effective. They have to be in the courage, the the one just above it, to be willing to be vulnerable, to be willing to look in order for me to help them. If there's too much resistance or too much pride of like, I'm right, I'm fine the way I am now, I can't be of assistance. Um, I tend not to attract that anymore. But in the beginning, I remember, you know, thinking, oh, that person could really use what I have, and they're like, you know, so it's really, you know, I'm a big human design fan. I think that's a really good system to understand what's your best way to attract or work with or consider where the right clients for you. You know, I'm one of those where I have to wait for the invitation. So I have to set it up so that people want to invite me in. Otherwise, it doesn't work for me. So it's taking me some time to learn that.

Pedro Stein 12:48

Nice. Okay. So that's the coaching side, right? But now let's talk about the part nobody escapes, which is marketing, right? So, how those soulful high achievers tend to find you, you know.

Wendy Watson-Hallowell 13:03

I have been terrible at this. I just I gotta confess, I have not, I've had such a word-of-mouth business because I've been in the business I've been in for so long. And so marketing has been really tough for me. You know, I I followed some of my friends and some of what they were doing because they had a big Instagram group or they had a lot of people responding. So I did the whole, all right, let me come up with you know, good uh posts. And because I was writing a lot, so I figured, great, I have these blogs, I have like 250 blogs, wonderful. I'll use those to kind of get things out. Hired a virtual assistant, does what I ask. I got nothing because I don't know what I'm doing. I really don't. And so um I've tried a lot of things, um, nothing's really worked. And I I guess what I realize is what I won't want to suggest to anybody else. It's like you have to figure out where are you in your own business and what's really needed right now. So for instance, uh I'm like I'm working now with uh it's Caitlin uh Backler. She does scale for success because what I I have this incredible online course, I use it with all my clients, it creates wonderful transformation, and I'm not making a dime from it because it's part of my coaching. And and it's an evergreen course that works fine by itself. So I'm learning how to create the whole back end of including the webinar, including how to talk about it. I've I've helped it's helped me refine how I talk about what I'm doing so much, so much clearer, so much more the pain points that are relevant. So uh, and and again, it's a long process, it's like 16 weeks and it's a lot of work. And it's really making a difference in the way I think about it, in the way I talk about it, and I can see it's gonna make a difference for me from an income perspective. So I'm that's been really helpful.

Pedro Stein 14:59

I love how open you are about it, right? Your own stuff. It's like I'm terrible at marketing. I love the the vulnerability, you know. Wendy, it's something that I feel like it's uh I always say this in the podcast, so I keep repeating myself. I see like uh a key asset for a true coach is being vulnerable because they can connect easier with the coachy, you know. It's harder to connect with someone who's like in a preaching mode, and because it distances the relationship, like I'm in the teaching side and you're the student and all of that. So the way you frame yourself, it's so human, you know. So I commend you on that. That's pretty cool.

Wendy Watson-Hallowell 15:38

Thank you, Pudra. Because I used to be the the nickname I had, and I couldn't stand it when I heard it was like I used to come off like a know-it-all. And the thing that changed was that belief. The minute my ego stopped being in charge and started playing the right role in my life, vulnerability became easy because I didn't think I was a problem anymore. So I can share whatever's happening with me because I think I'm enough no matter what it is, and that changes the whole perspective. So while it may feel like vulnerability to you, for me, it's just honesty about what's happening for me without any self-judgment. So that's what I help people with, is exactly that kind of thing. Because when we feel that fear of exposure, it's because we've had experiences that taught us, you know, we got bad stuff when that happened. And so our ego comes up with a story to help us protect ourselves. And usually the story is about how we're the problem. So once you bust that up and you start realizing, hang on a minute, that's actually not true. And you really get that in your bones. Like I told you when we had the conversation before, I was blissed out for two weeks. When I when that suddenly was no longer true, and I saw the lie in it, and I didn't say that was me anymore, everything changed. Um, I got a lot of my energy back, I got a lot of my happiness back. Um and so yeah, it made me a better coach for sure. Because I can I've been in everybody's shoes, and everyone who shows up in in you know, for me is the next thing I'm working on. So, like I have to stay humble because we're all in this together.

Pedro Stein 17:24

Well, easier to say, but not as easy as we can see people not practicing it, right? It's like unfortunately, some people are on their own way, and I think that's one of the reasons you're doing what you do. Now, I want to talk about business for a moment, right? Because you met you mentioned the online course, and there's also the coaching component. So, what I want to know is like picture me as one of your soulful high achievers, okay, and I'm being on boarded, right? We close the deal, Pedro is in a deposit was made. So, what would that look like from the client's perspective? My Pedro, right, in the situation, from my point of view, working with you, right? How does the structure work?

Wendy Watson-Hallowell 18:10

Yeah, working with me as a coach. Um, from a process perspective, typically what would happen is you and I would have a brief conversation or you'd say, Hey, my friend Tracy told me I should come talk to you because I'm dealing with XYZ. Be like, great, we would then have probably a quick 30-minute discovery call just for me to hear where you're at and get that sense of like, are you still in pride and you're righteous and you just want someone to validate that you're you're right and they're wrong? Because I don't want to do that. So I make sure it's a good fit in that first 45-minute call. And then what I do is I um explain to them the process, which is, you know, what we're gonna do is have a goal setting. And in that goal setting, we're gonna decide what is success free, what's gonna be different when we're done, and in tangible present-time ways. And then we're gonna decide, given that those are your goals, how many coaching sessions do we both think it's gonna take? I usually do packages between six and 12 sessions, and my client and I agree together about what it's gonna take. If someone comes and goes, I am just a mess in like four areas of my life, I look at them and go, okay, so we're gonna start with 12. Um, and then we'll see where we go from there. And they're fine with that. So we agree on that. And and then we have a goal setting session where we actually do that. And at that point, we've agreed on what it's gonna be. I agree, you know, then we talk about doing a deposit or doing the full amount. So that's my process. I don't ask for your money until we've set goals and agreed on how much and we want to move forward. Because out of maybe a hundred people, I've had one or two who get to that point and go, I don't think I'm ready. This is scaring the hell out of me. Um, and so I want people to know they don't have to commit until we do that. And if these goals help you, great, go with them. So it's at that point that it's someone's making a commitment. And then, you know, most of my clients pay up front, but if they can't, I'll do a payment plan with them. You know, it just depends on what's going on and what's with someone. Um, my rates for that, those packages are between 1500 and 2500. And, you know, if it's less sessions, we figure that out. I'm trying to think if I had any who've actually I've had to return sessions to. Nah, not really. We're we're because we do it together. It's not just me saying you need this, it's given that you're trying to get here, and if this is how you're feeling right now, you know, and typically the way it works is I give my clients homework. And some of it is connecting to my online course, right? Do the first two modules in here, you know, write your notes, and that's your homework, and we'll debrief on it together. The coaching sessions I have are for debriefing, it's for uh surfacing any questions that came up or or helping integrate what has occurred and what's next, and it helps me know the next kind of homework to give them. There's some standard stuff I use that typically is with everybody, um, and then I have a whole bunch of other things I pull from that are relevant to that person. And sometimes I create things for people because they inspire me. It's like, oh, we need something like this, but focus that way. So it's fun because it keeps me creating stuff. Um, and so I don't do a weekly structure, I let the customer set the pace because everybody's life is different, everybody focuses different. And for some people, I've got one right now, she can't seem to make it to her first session because she's so focused on taking care of everybody else, and that always becomes the priority. And she goes unconscious. The minute someone says, I need everything about her, goes out the window, and it's all about them. So it's it's the issue she's dealing with, but we can't even get to the first session. So, and she's paid, you know, it's not a money thing. So everybody's in a different place, and it's um finding a way to have the client be in control of what's happening because what we're doing is looking. Looking at stuff that scares your ego, and your ego doesn't want you to do that. And so you have to be in a place of courage to be able to go, I feel my ego going, no, no, no, no, no. And I'm gonna go do this thing anyway. I'm gonna go look at this, I'm gonna do this homework. So, um, and the last part about my coaching, um, I I write up a recap every time so that people can, and I give them the zoom, like I record it, I give them, but I write up my own recap. I don't let the AI recap it because I want to pull out the things that are important for them to integrate and be ready to move forward on. So they get written recap from me, and some of them listen to the recording. Um when I also will give some of my clients books, I will send them a journal in their favorite color. Um, so it's just a whole bunch of things up front so that people feel cared for and safe and that I'm on the journey with them. Um, the the thing that I find really important about my coaching, I'm available 24-7. When you're in a coaching relationship with me, you can text me, you can call me, you can email me 24-7. I will take care of myself. You know, if you call me at three in the morning, I won't call you till I'm up at 6:30, but I will call you back. So, so um, and this is always an issue with scaling, right? The way I'm set up right now, it's just me. I do enough so that I can have that kind of relationship. And with my Evergreen course, I'm moving to once a week an hour coaching online for everybody going through the course. So that's a big change. It's gonna be like, okay, and I don't know if that's gonna be manageable or if I'm gonna need help again, scaling wise. So I'm trying to do it at a pace that works for me. So yeah, so that's it. And then at the end, I recap everything for you and and uh send it to you. And some people go for another round. Once in a while, someone will call and go, okay, I'm up against this. We're finally having this fight, this thing. Can I get a coaching session? But I don't do individual coaching sessions if I haven't already coached you. It's not worth it. I can't help you move significantly in a single call.

Pedro Stein 24:14

You know, Wendy, it it looks like you can tell the future because I was about to ask you about capacity, right? We're talking about a white glove experience. We're talking about, you know, you're an author, you have a consulting branch, you have a coaching piece, but you already kind of answered that. You're moving towards a more like a passive or one-to-many style, so you can actually scale, right? It makes sense. So I'm gonna skip that. I'm gonna ask you another thing. Because one thing every coach wrestles, and you already mentioned this, the the the hard numbers, right? And pricing. It's like how to package their work, you know. But what I want to hear from you is the mindset behind it, right? At the start, especially in the early days, it's like that scarcity mindset. You're looking at your calendar, it's empty, and you're like, oh my God, I could be charging X, Y, and Z less, and this would look packed. Not really what happened, right?

Speaker 1 25:10

So yeah, yeah.

Pedro Stein 25:12

So how how do you think about it today, the pricing, right? And and were there any lessons along the way that shape how you landed where you are?

Wendy Watson-Hallowell 25:21

Oh my gosh, lessons like crazy. And and it it really shows up when you go and raise your prices. That's when it really shows up. When you go from, okay, I used to charge this and now I'm raising my prices. COVID actually helped me do that. I I have to admit, COVID helped me do it because I understood more the value of what I was uh um helping to create. Um, so that helped a whole bunch. So, two things. One, you gotta get clear about your customers. If you're not clear about your customers, and I wasn't early, you will take every hurting victim out there who can barely pay you and will pay you, you know, a hundred dollars a month for two years. Like it just starts to get kind of silly. Um, so you have to decide who your customers and you have to decide the value you're giving them. Um, you know, Caitlin's good because in thinking about the Evergreen course, she makes you think through um, what's the value of the coaching? What's the value of the course? What's the value of the community if you have like a group community, like a lot of coaches do, whether it's on Facebook or you know, wherever they're doing it. So you got to think about the value of that. Um and the easiest way to do that is to think about how are they different, right? It's it's I'm an outcome person, I can't not think about that. How, what is success? How are they different when they're done with you? And how big a deal is that? You know, for me, I take people from inner chaos to inner peace. For me, in my own life, that was so huge that I know it's high value. At the same time, I also have to be clear about who's my customer. My customer is not, they're not in the C-suite. They're just they're usually below the C-suite. Um, in a smaller organization, they may be the leader, the executive director, or the board chair, but in big corporations, they're not the C-suite. They're the level below that, or maybe even the level below that. They own a budget, they're responsible for how it works, they have control over that, but they're dealing in the hierarchy, you know, and and all the craziness that goes on. So I think that's when I think about what they can afford. And when I was that person in corporate America, what was it worth it for me? What am I willing to pay? Um, like I'm paying for Caitlin's course right now, and given the potential out of it, and given what it's helping me with, the return is amazing. Um, do I have to do a payment plan? Yes, I do have to do a payment plan right now, given where my own finances are. So I think the the essence of this is how do you invest in yourself and in your coaching business? And if you don't price it in a way that equals the value, you'll never have what you need to invest back in. You you it has to be that flow has to come back in. And so when you think about it that way, what's the value? Am I focused on the customers that I need? And again, it has to be niche. I would love it to be everybody because I want everybody to transform. But I do best with this group. If other people come in because of that, wonderful. But I know who I can do best with, and that's what I want to make happen. So again, that customer piece, the value that you offer, um, and understanding what is reasonable for them. Like, I know 2500 bucks for the people I'm talking about for the kind of change I'm getting to, that's worth it. If they're ready to change, if they're like, eh, no, no, it's not my first priority. Like, it has to be your first or second priority, like the kids first and then you. It can't be something else. So, yeah, that's the thing I found in these people changing. You have to be at a place of readiness, of like, okay, I'm tired of that. I'm ready to change. I don't know how, but I'm ready. And and that's what I'm always listening for. I also use a self-assessment process. I do have a written self-assessment that clients who are not as expressive or um less vulnerable, you know, as you put it, I'll make them write it down there. So then at least it opens up the conversation. And again, it's you know, things like, you know, what part of your life isn't working great. If it was working great, what would it be like? What do you think's in the way of that? You know, I mean, they're they're rational questions, but then someone can unfold and share what's happening with them.

Pedro Stein 29:59

Interesting. So it's about clarity on who you serve and also clarity, uh, clarity on the outcome you're delivering.

Wendy Watson-Hallowell 30:07

And yeah, as the value that you're adding. Okay, you know, and you you may look at value during the process. Wow, someone's safe. I can actually look at my stuff with. Wow, that's not the outcome, it's the condition, you know. And it's like, okay, because I can offer that, the person can transform. I think about some of my clients, and it just you know makes brings happy, joy, tears to my eyes because they're so different. They're where they were afraid and used to people please, now they stand up for themselves or walk away and without any drama. And it's like, wow, you're so inspiring. You know, people are so amazing.

Pedro Stein 30:50

Now, Wendy, I'm curious about where you're taking all this, right? Looking ahead, you know, where do you see the business going? Are you thinking about scaling, hiring, or is that a next step you're excited about?

Wendy Watson-Hallowell 31:01

Yeah, um, yeah, actually, two. One with my online course, um, scaling that. Like, I I'm committed to $30,000 months, and I understand how I can generate that pretty effortlessly now. I was like, oh my gosh, that makes so much sense. Duh. You know, so it's been that kind of thing where it's like, oh, and and I got sucked right into her funnel and bought. And I was like, okay, I don't often get sucked into that, so I gotta really look at this. You know, again, it surprised me. I was like, oh, well, yeah. So I'm excited about that. I'm I'm um again, I have to experiment, but I'm hoping by you know, end of second quarter, early third quarter, I'm starting to move in that direction. And I've connected up with a group that does visual surveys, which is kind of the future. Instead of words, you use pictures so you get the emotional reaction instead of the mental reaction. And I've been using it and getting incredible results with it. Um actually have a call this afternoon, and so that's kind of a new thing that came into my life, and I've been able to find great cases with my own clients, and then I'm selling it for them, and now they want to give me a commission. And it's like, oh, so that's cool. Um, and then the last part is that I partner with software groups I have for a long time because of the outcome stuff, and I've reconnected with um an old team that I loved working with, and they're like, hey, we need to talk to this group, we need to talk to this group, and hey, when we get to this, this this is gonna be great for them. And so because I'm excited and clear that I'm working with the people I want to and in the environments I want to, and I've said no to the ones that don't resonate for me, it's like the universe is listening. Oh, you don't want that? Okay, we'll bring you more of this. So I've been working that, and so yeah, I would really like to have three times my income in three years so I can invest in my business, but also take care of my husband. You know, he's had strokes and seizures, and I'd really like to set things up so that he can get more support. And so, yeah, so I got some good goals, and I find when when there's things that you really want, that's when money starts to flow. If there's nowhere for it to go except a bank account that it just sits in, usually it doesn't flow very well. Safety isn't the number in there, it's the flow moving through.

Pedro Stein 33:24

Yeah, there are no guarantees in life, right? And it's like you're more you're more like now connected to an abundance mindset instead of a scarcity mindset, which is fear and never brings anything good out of it. Now, I'm curious, Wendy, you know, whenever because whenever we're aiming towards the next chapter, always something we're refining in the present, right? Always something under the hood. So, what are you currently trying to improve or tighten up in your business right now? Anything specific comes to mind?

Wendy Watson-Hallowell 33:54

Yeah, I think right now it's balancing both the coaching and the consulting again. Now that the consulting is starting to flow back in in an unexpected way, like I had to update my website. Like I had to like really start to pull that together and make sure the two are connected. And so I think the next thing is for me to think about how I package them together. That's that's really because I want them each to feed each other. That's where I'm my business is the happiest when they feed each other. The the coaching clients also are parts of organizations and say, hey, come consult with me. And the can you know the consulting gigs are also saying, hey, we need some coaching. And uh yeah.

Pedro Stein 34:36

So it's about finding that synergy between them so you can connect with the right people in both ends, something like that.

Wendy Watson-Hallowell 34:43

Yeah, I yeah, like I proposed a whole bunch of sessions to um uh again, a big software provider that uh my client base, my customer base attends. And I used to have a very deep relationship with them when I was part of the organization I was part of. And um, you know, they have a great conference every year, and it's a lot of my clients. So uh my colleague and I actually call him my collaborative partner. I have two collaborative partners that allow me to do the work I do. I can't do this alone. The projects are too big. So I've got two other people and they're on my website as collaborative partners. They have their own businesses, but we work together, which I think is kind of the new the new way. But anyway, we proposed five different sessions, and three of them are are about uh kind of the the coaching side of it, and two of them, you know, like the personal development and the the how do I manage in here, and then two of them are really about outcomes. So it's gonna be interesting to see what they select, if anything, um, but what their appetite is right now. And we're hoping they pick at least one from A and one from B. Because if you're gonna be at a conference, one session doesn't give you dookie. And ideally, you have a couple of different opportunities to be, you know, I'm gonna do a short talk and be part of a panel, and I'm gonna hold, you know, some one-on-one sessions over here, and you know, you try and do as much as you can. I always bring a couple books and then you know, ask people to put their business card in to raffle off the books, and then I add them to my mailing list. So at least the people in the room at the conference I then can have as as you know on my mailing list, which is really important. You gotta keep that mailing list happy.

Pedro Stein 36:21

Hmm. Interesting. You know, I have a question for you because you have that lens that you can, you know, uh it's somewhat of a hybrid uh mentality. You can walk between coaching and consulting. I think that's very interesting. And one question I have for you, it's like, you know, when there are some problems in the budget, and I'm talking B2B right now, it's like sometimes companies what they do is get out the coaching budget, right? It's like almost immediately. Okay. So my question to you is how do you or how do you make them see or how do you frame uh the value, you know, the outcome for such a KPI-driven uh mentality, you know, to justify the investment. How do we track it? Oh, it was Wendy who did X, Y, and Z, and that's why we have an increase in bottom line, we have an increase in culture. You know what I'm saying?

Wendy Watson-Hallowell 37:17

It's like sometimes it feels absolutely in all my contracts, I have very specific outcomes. We've succeeded when people are doing this and the conditions look like that. So behavior and condition are the two things that I always focus on for outcomes because you can see them, they're concrete, you know, or you can ask a question, do you feel better now? I do. Okay, you know, so um, so that becomes the focus. So I build that into all my contracts so that we're clear about this is what success is. So that's what we're working towards. And it gives me the freedom to change the things I was gonna do if it's not getting us closer, or if the client isn't coming through on what they need to do, and I usually try and be clear up front, I'm gonna need you to focus here, we're gonna need to have a weekly meeting. You know, if they're not doing the things they need to do, then again, I'll stop the action and go because you guys aren't doing this, we're not gonna get to these changes. So I use that as the motivation. Sometimes those changes stop being important because in corporations there's re-orgs, there's takeovers, there's so much stuff that happens. I just had that with a group and I was I was making 60 to 70 grand a year with them doing consulting stuff, culture stuff, strategy stuff, and coaching. And the new leader decided we can't spend that money on that. And the old leader still wanted to do it, but at the corporation, they give every employee at a certain level and up a thousand dollars for personal development, and so five out of those 10 uh employees decided to use that money to get my coaching instead. So for me, that's the testament. Now the leader is leaving this year, and that's gonna shake things out again because if she doesn't, then the group that I've been working with is all they're all gonna leave and fall apart. So they've been waiting for this to happen. And I mean, I've been with them for a really long time, I think like 17 years, through several different iterations and a lot of work, whereas they're all the time to like I'm only working the five of them now, and one of them's doing out of their own personal fund. The leader who brought me in originally, I'm still doing coaching with her out of her personal pocket because she finds she's made such strides, it's amazing. So she finds the value in it, and that's why she's always gonna spend the money on it. If this leader leaves, she will bake it back into her budget. So, so the other thing that I think is important in this conversation, Pedro, is knowing when to walk. You don't have to fight for the value you offer. You do have to be clear and you do have to be concrete enough so that a leader can see why it meets and addresses their pain points. But they either care about that a lot or they don't. Like this leader who's been a problem, not into personal growth, not accountable, responsible, very suspicious, very fear-based, um, a bit of a micromanager, very critical. And so people struggle with that, not taking it personally, seeing that that's just who she is, it's not about that. So, you know, again, you have family dynamics in the middle of companies all the time because we don't clear them before we move into the workplace. So you, you know, you start you see the same thing in a company just like you do in a person in their life. It's you know, the same, we bring the same patterns. You know, one of my favorite things is I try and create common ground where I get people to get clear about the experience they want to have together in their work relationship, and then what do they actually want from each other to make that happen and how to negotiate that? Um, so again, it's tricky when you're in different levels of authority and but this is it's the same stuff we're dealing with every day. I still think my mom is the authority. So when she says something, I drop what's important to me and do what's right for her. I don't want to do that anymore. You know, it's it's the same thing. Um so yeah, I hope that answers it. No, it does.

Pedro Stein 41:20

Yes, it does. And I love that. Now, if someone listening wants to connect with you or follow your work, Wendy, where can people find you and connect with you?

Wendy Watson-Hallowell 41:29

The easiest place is to go to my website, which is www.belief-works.com. You can also just email me directly, Wendy, at beliefworks.com. If you're looking for me out on social media, you'll find me under the belief coach. I'm on Facebook, I'm on Insta, I'm on YouTube, I'm on LinkedIn. I don't know how much that's helping my business, but I'm I'm learning how to do that better.

Pedro Stein 41:58

So you know, and there were a few moments from this chat today that really, you know, um stayed with me and put it like that. Um, first, the origin story, right? Coming from MTV and having that pivot from 10 years ago that you made the breakthrough yourself on the belief that was holding you back, you know, and and the way you let go of the ego, like you told me. So that's very interesting. Also, when you told me the identity shift is real, right? When you oh, I'm a coach, I I love that it's like you're putting on the hat, and it's like not that you can't consult anymore, but it's a different mindset, it's a different lens. And when I talked about vulnerability, you're like, yeah, not necessarily vulnerable being vulnerable, it's just like about being true to yourself, right? I mean, it's just taking out the obstacles, and in front of you, it's like, oh, this is who I am, and I own it and just keep moving forward. Another thing that caught my attention, and I feel like this is very interesting, it's like you have a paid client, right? But she's not taking sessions and she's uh is still worrying about other people. And I can resonate with that. Like sometimes, I'm not sure if you ever did that, but I did. It's like I donated money for a gym, you know, for a gym membership for a year, but didn't really get there, you know, a lot. It's I think we have sometimes that mindset of, oh, I'm doing something, but in reality, not really put it into work just to, you know, have a better night of sleep. Oh no, I'm taking care of myself. I got a gym membership. I I don't hit that very often.

Wendy Watson-Hallowell 43:40

Pedro, that's the ego. It's the ego, exactly. And it runs most of our life, and we don't know how to relate to it in a way where it can do its correct job again. And so we lie to ourselves all the time, constantly. You know, I caught myself this morning, my housemate is moving out, and it's been a little messy on the way out. And um, you know, I was like, okay, well, he said this. Is there any truth to that? And I thought, you know what? Yeah, there is some truth to that. And I don't want to do that to my husband. So that's something I'm gonna keep an eye on. That's just not something I want to do.

Pedro Stein 44:15

Yeah, sometimes we go back to the coping mechanisms, the ego, we go back to and we try to ignore the root cause, but it's still there.

Wendy Watson-Hallowell 44:24

And we just have to be gentle and compassionate with ourselves. We're doing the best we can. We don't have a different operating system. We're trying to find our way out of the one that isn't functioning anymore, but we usually don't have a roadmap, which is why I got excited about doing what I do, because it it gives you a way to become, I'm gonna call it the inner leader, the one in charge that lets you the language I love is sovereignty, personal sovereignty. I am a sovereign being in body, mind, emotion, and spirit. And I choose my experience, and I know that I'm co-creating my experience. So because I know that I don't blame other people, unless I'm complaining and haven't sorted that out, which I was doing the last couple of weeks. Um, so so you you start shifting your role here, and then things start changing. You start realizing, wait, I have a say in how this experience goes for me. I'm not, I'm at cause about what goes on. I can say yes or no to what I want, I can create better boundaries, and someone can either either honor that or not. Um, and if they don't, I get to choose what's best for me because that's my job. So, you know, look, I had a really tough upbringing, and and the contrast helped me realize what was actually going on instead of going, it's all their fault and I'm right, which I did for a long time. You know, once you start realizing everybody's on the same journey, we're all doing the best we can in making that move out of not being conscious and thinking everything's happening to us and becoming conscious and realizing we have a say in how things go. And the more people who realize that, the faster and easier it's going to be for all the rest of us to move in that direction. So anything you're doing or anything I'm doing, or all the rest of the coaches that are listening to this are doing towards that is helping us as humanity, literally. Um, it's it's a very sacred job, even if you're just learning how to do it, it makes a difference.

Pedro Stein 46:31

Yeah, I agree with that. And this was just my long way of saying that I appreciate what you do, and I appreciate you being here and sharing so openly today. You know, Wendy. It was great having you on.

Wendy Watson-Hallowell 46:43

It was my pleasure, and I'm so glad I know you guys exist, and now I get to learn more about what you all do, which is really fun too.

Davis Nguyen 46:51

That's it for this episode of Career Coaching Secrets. If you enjoyed this conversation, you can subscribe to YouTube, Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you're listening to this episode to catch future episodes. This conversation was brought to you by Purple Circle, where we help career coaches scale their business to seven and eight figures without burning out. To learn more about Purple Circle, our community, and how we can help you grow your business, visit joinpurplecircle.com.